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Messages - Whitebleidd

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Spacelords Universe / Re: Let's have a chat about Antagonist.

on: December 06, 2019, 05:00:41 AM

Quote from: zMalevolencEz on December 06, 2019, 02:49:21 AM

Quote from: TheBrentWoody on December 04, 2019, 12:10:06 AM
Antag is the ENTIRE point of the game. It's THE unique feature and style of this game. Antag haters...*** out. Hahah. But seriously, matches with them are more interesting and fun. Matches without them are boring. That's just how it is.

The only person to read the content of my post. Good job Brent. This isn't about the separation of PVP or PVE. It's not about adding/buffing Antagonist it's about restoring the orginal 4v1 aspect this game was built on.

Regardless of anyone's narrowminded interpretation this is a 4v1 PvPvE game, how you choose to play these elements are your choice. If coop is your thing good for you if its PvP then they got that covered to. The reason Antagonist matches can be "boring" or "downright shameful" has a lot to do with mission difficulty or lack there of when an antagonist is present. Not all antagonist are effective in playing the mode either. Those who are winning now will likely be winning regardless however even the guys who are successful notice and have been voice concern.

The whole purpose of this post is to inform MSE as well as people who enjoy the Antagonist mode that it currently in an unmanageable state and needs to be looked at a little closer.

lol his post had nothing to do with the topic, all he did was declare his love of the antagonist system and then demand posters leave a thread from a public forum… and in such a toxic way it appears mods had to edit his post.
What you ask for imo cannot be achieved because of the changes that were made to aleph and ammo, infinite ammo could be seen as a bad idea from a mile away, and how it was going to break stuff for both raiders and antags.

What you describe sounds like MSE balancing things out so that antag win rate gets lower, which is healthy for the community as a whole, since they insist on not dividing pvp and pve. What they mayb should do in that case is change the grading system for antags, not have it rely on winning, have it grade antags based on performance alone (kills, damage done, objective delay, etc) regardless of if they won or lost, and make it possible for them to get 7-8 scores even with a loss.

Dividing PVP and PVE also enters again into your discussion as a valid point, since it would allow for fine tuning things specifically for PVP scenarios, maybe even more standardized stats for the AI on the antag side, raising the minimum threshold for their HP, damage and reaction times, making them more useful, since the game wouldn’t have to account for noobs, PVE players and lower mmrs.

Spacelords Universe / Re: Let's have a chat about Antagonist.

on: December 04, 2019, 08:04:28 PM

Quote from: TheBrentWoody on December 04, 2019, 12:10:06 AM

Antag is the ENTIRE point of the game. It's THE unique feature and style of this game. Antag haters...*** out. Hahah.

I must have missed the ENTIRE point of the game for hundreds of hours then because I specifically played the game for its PVE/coop and enjoyed that aspect a lot.

Quote from: TheBrentWoody on December 04, 2019, 12:10:06 AM

But seriously, matches with them are more interesting and fun. Matches without them are boring. That's just how it is.

Not unsurprising seeing pvp’ers with the mental and competitive maturity of a child spout completely subjective statements as true.

Let me try, but seriously matches with antagonists are not fun, boring, most times downright broken and a total waste of time. That’s just how it is…

Suggestions / Re: Reasons for Optional PvP

on: August 14, 2019, 06:01:24 PM

Quote from: SergeyKosinskiy on August 14, 2019, 01:17:40 PM

Also i have another idea why make it optional? Better to make it pure pvp. No game without antag.

Indeed, I’ve personally also suggested this, they should either cut the crap, fully commit to PVP and have it as a requirement to start a match, or make it optional, because what we have now is a completely disrespectful system tailored to griefers.

Quote from: SergeyKosinskiy on August 14, 2019, 01:17:40 PM

All popular games with big following are pvp ones.

There’s a few big and successful PVP games but the majority of PVP games released to the market fall flat on their faces, its high risk high reward when a dev team decides to tackle them, PVE games however have more of a safety cushion and are in general more widely played.

Quote from: SergeyKosinskiy on August 14, 2019, 03:04:41 PM

but if we look at top of what is streamed it will be mostly pvp games.

Stream viewership doesn’t reflect player count.

Suggestions / Re: Reasons for Optional PvP

on: August 13, 2019, 01:03:03 PM

Nice collection of great points that have been made over many posts (many of them downright irrefutable), a thread where the devs can have them readily available is always good.

Sadly, as Kuzie said, doubt they will listen, but since I’m betting most of us love the game, we continue to try like hopeful fools…

Gameplay Feedback / Re: New "natural aleph deposit" system.

on: August 03, 2019, 09:45:36 PM

Quote from: ScimitarSlice on August 03, 2019, 04:26:04 PM

this thread is about new aleph system. what is your opinion?

Imo I wouldn’t even bother asking SergeyKosinskiy about his stance on anything the devs do, just assume he thinks it’s great…

Quote from: SergeyKosinskiy on August 03, 2019, 08:52:12 PM

Map control is pretty important now too.

You can see it in stuff like this, that’s just stuff the devs were making up to try and sell the new dumbass system, so he just regurgitates it here, even though ofc map control is not important, and I doubt any decent player after doing some matches with the new system would buy into that crap.

Gameplay Feedback / Re: New "natural aleph deposit" system.

on: August 03, 2019, 12:29:39 AM

So got around to testing this new system and with the added perspective of doing so as a lower lvl player (since I used my console smurf account because I had uninstalled the game from steam).

Not a whole lot to add, it ended up being as bad, boring as it sounded, with added issues I had not imagined, such as aleph scarcity. It brings only tedium, especially if you are a 5th council (other than Ginebra), killing elites lost its rewarding feeling as expected and quite simply looking around the environment for aleph deposits =/= fun, man it was depressing doing “Hanging by a Thread”, seeing all those elites that spawn at the beginning of the last phase and knowing they mean nothing.

Since the aleph deposits are most certainly not OP the only kind of band-aid temporary fix I can imagine is reducing the aleph they spawn to only 1 (regardless of mmr) while giving back aleph to elites, and have them simply be an alternative way of gaining aleph, the kind of thing you just bump into but not necessarily waste time hunting for.

But in general the whole state of the game is currently depressing, sadly the bad in recent updates vastly outweighs the good, like I was telling a veteran raider I frequently group up with the other day (one that has been in the game even longer than I), at least we got to experience the game in its kind of “golden age” when it was buy to play, post Hades, because what we have now is just a shell of what once was…

Suggestions / Re: MSE Please just give us an antagonist option.

on: July 31, 2019, 09:57:56 PM

Quote from: TheNobleWolf on July 31, 2019, 09:26:20 PM

This screws people who like playing Antagonist.

The current system screws over those who like playing as raider, those that are low lvl, that are trying new characters, those that want to only pve, those that are trying to obtain a blueprint, etc, the current system screws over way more ppl in favour of just antags, plus throwing ppl into a pvp queue against their will just to fill in spots for pvp’ers has never been a valid excuse, even if the developers themselves claim so, as is the case here.

Gameplay Feedback / Re: New "natural aleph deposit" system.

on: July 31, 2019, 08:00:39 PM

1) Indeed maps were not designed with this in mind

2) The new system will further force players to run around like headless chicken looking for aleph, as if looking for aleph dropped after killing an elite wasn’t bad enough…

3) The new system takes away all the fun that was to be had from getting a finisher on an elite

4) I can already see players not doing objectives and/or taking care of mobs and simply hanging around known aleph spawns.

5) The new system even further destroys the flow of combat/gameplay, before when aleph and ammo were obtained from mobs directly everything had a nice rhythm, you obtain resources as you did combat, it was very satisfying.

6) Last but certainly not least, the system is simply boring and mundane, the type of system that is used everywhere…

Are we supposed to cheer and clap when a unique system is dumbed down to this level?

Gameplay Feedback / Re: 3 Dailies, 3 X T2 R6 teammates and 3 T1 Antags & lost rare BP.

on: July 27, 2019, 03:45:07 AM

Quote from: sonofoz on July 27, 2019, 02:09:42 AM

and i don't really see your point... you want to be better to what ?
once you have a forge lvl 10 you're at max strength, there is nothing more to gain to be better except skills, wich you deny to the game...
so progress in what ?

Like most normal ppl I’m just looking to chill and play a game, purely for enjoyment, I’m not here to prove my skill to anyone, nor could I care less about what others think my skill is, I just want to progress, farm resources and enjoy myself playing with badass, entertaining and unique characters, and have fun killing mobs.

Quote from: sonofoz on July 27, 2019, 02:09:42 AM

consequently, if you just want to play the game in coop, training mode like in other mobas should be enough, since you don't want to play against other players and therefore doesn't need as much forge lvl.

I have no issues playing the game with others (when I can enjoy an antag free match), but there has also been many ppl, especially in the steam forums and reviews asking for a single player mode, with actual continuous rewards, I see nothing wrong in this, let ppl have fun with the game and be rewarded for it, matches should also be allowed to start with less than 4 players, for those ppl that want to play matches sometimes only with friends. Both these things are reasonable and should not be hard to implement, since they can already occur in the game, hell apparently the Cortez bros can now even deposit aleph, in all these cases ppl are investing their time (and possibly money) and should be rewarded, so all modes should allow for obtaining blueprints and all resources.

Ppl that want to PVP should do so because they enjoy it and they should not expect others be dragged into their mode. If I was you I would take your own advice and start behaving like the “grown up” you say you are, and stop crying like a child when some ppl don’t want to play the mode you do…

Gameplay Feedback / Re: 3 Dailies, 3 X T2 R6 teammates and 3 T1 Antags & lost rare BP.

on: July 27, 2019, 01:37:19 AM

Quote from: sonofoz on July 27, 2019, 01:04:44 AM

i stated long ago that the game sould have a full AI mode.
with no possibility of BP obtention and at least all rewards halved.
in a word a coop training mode, as there is in all mabos too. =)

Basically a mode where no one can progress and therefore won’t be able to be much of a threat, forcing them into antag matches anyways, if they want to progress, how laughable and convenient.

Gameplay Feedback / Re: 3 Dailies, 3 X T2 R6 teammates and 3 T1 Antags & lost rare BP.

on: July 26, 2019, 11:43:45 PM

Quote from: sonofoz on July 26, 2019, 11:35:36 PM

so except in your imagination, there is no antag on a side and raider on the others... there is just players.

Yes, there are sides, its excusable and understandable when you are lower level, figuring out how the game even works, but past a certain amount of levels/hours there is no excuse, if you are queueing as antag you know what you are doing, and you are a coward for doing so.

Gameplay Feedback / Re: 3 Dailies, 3 X T2 R6 teammates and 3 T1 Antags & lost rare BP.

on: July 26, 2019, 11:22:04 PM

Quote from: sonofoz on July 26, 2019, 10:55:31 PM

Quote
I am not a coward like antags.
oh yeah... certainly... that's why you only play with 4 people to protect you =)

Quote
had no issues winning on either side
wich bring us to my last 2 advices : learn to play and learn to defend yourself.

Quote
once I reached max forge and had more experience winning became disgustingly easy, especially against newer players.
wich makes you a coward unable to defend himself except against the weakest...
cause i see lot of people myslef included, who won matches as raider or antag, against higher ranks, as i encountered lower ranks who did great job...

Do you have some reading comprehension issues? Your answers make no sense, you answered as if I had said I had issues dealing with antags, but my statements were the complete opposite of that o_O

Quote from: sonofoz on July 26, 2019, 10:55:31 PM

Quote
this games PVP is NOT about skill, if you think so, maybe some more time invested in the game is required
yes or maybe YOU should.
maybe stop running straight forward thinking you'll win, and you'll see you can elaborates strategy, even in cqc...

Again where is that even coming from, I alluded to the inefficiency of a frontal attack in my posts in this thread, rest assured I know running straight forward into combat isn’t recommended in this game, the game actively discourages it, especially if you are an antag, attacking raiders when they are distracted is the most efficient course of action, which again goes back to why this games PVP is for cowards, combine cheesy builds + attacking players while they are distracted + playing against lowbies and/or PVE players = some pathetically sad PVP.

The first step this game NEEDS before its PVP can even have a chance at becoming something, is making it optional, after that there’s still a lot of work, but until then this games PVP isn’t even worth considering.

But ofc antags fear this, having PVP optional means the likely hood of facing equals is higher, this would mean newbies can level up, forge weapons, learn the game and overall prepare themselves before they jump into PVP, that means goodbye to farming newbies. This would also mean that when they release a new raider, high lvl players have a chance of obtaining blueprints and getting ready for PVP, which ofc means high level antag cowards won’t be able to have an advantage over a veteran player just because he is on a new character and has a forge0 weapon. Basically everyone has a chance to be at their best before engaging in PVP, which ofc scares antags.

Gameplay Feedback / Re: 3 Dailies, 3 X T2 R6 teammates and 3 T1 Antags & lost rare BP.

on: July 26, 2019, 10:38:31 PM

Quote from: sonofoz on July 26, 2019, 10:18:54 PM

Quote
the percentage of ppl in this game looking for some stupid, unbalanced and forced asymmetric pvp are not the majority

stop being carried and learn how ti defend yourself, maybe antags will be less a problem. the only problem in this game comes from the difficulty leveling, so the AI, not from the antags. antags are humans, sometimes you destroy them, sometimes they are better than you... as in all pvp games.

your only problem with antag is you don't stand being owned by human.
wich bring us to my last suggestion, learn to defend yourself...

Quote
it’s actually a minority of trollers and griefers that ofc found a game that was set up for them

oh yeah ? funny cause i'll always see the same fistfull of whiners against antag too.
well anyway, so maybe you should just find a game who is set up for you since this one is set up for us.
it will cost less time and money to devs and so they will have more to focus on the real problem of the game.

Quote
The irony in antags telling someone to get good or worst, them thinking that they themselves are good by winning an antag match
wich i find funny is people who are all "antag are overpowered", while they certainly never plays it, saying "no i'm to kind for this!" while the only reason is certainly they have nor the skills nor the guts.

when i encounter an antag who wipe the team, often, i have no regrets cause he was just better than me and most of the time i learned something from his fighting style.
and when i win as antag i'm glad, cause, for me at least, it's hard. usually far harder than defending my team as raider.

you don't want pvp ? go play warframe, there is much more things to do in it. otherwise, there is still iddle games and there economic system is close to this one.

The ONLY reason I don’t stand antags is for the reasons I stated in my previous post, I am not a coward like antags. Like everyone I was a new player once, and I played the antag system while I was figuring things out, had no issues winning on either side, in fact once I reached max forge and had more experience winning became disgustingly easy, especially against newer players.

Once I had invested enough time and had the knowledge to see the whole picture it was clear that although I enjoyed the game immensely, participating in its PVP aspect was dishonest and cowardly, I will not partake in matches where PVP was not a choice, where I am robbing others of their time and rewards and where levels make such a strong difference. Most matches when anyone is owning anyone, it’s because they outright cancel each other, because of raider picks, this games PVP is NOT about skill, if you think so, maybe some more time invested in the game is required.

You are winning matches that include newbies and PVE players, stop patting yourself in the back, since there is nothing to be proud of, toughen up and ask the devs for real PVP, one where it’s a choice and YOU and YOUR opponent are at least on the same page, or continue to fight in forced PVP, fighting opponents that cant properly fight back, or are not interested in fighting back and remain a coward.

Gameplay Feedback / Re: 3 Dailies, 3 X T2 R6 teammates and 3 T1 Antags & lost rare BP.

on: July 26, 2019, 09:55:17 PM

Quote from: sonofoz on July 26, 2019, 04:48:19 PM

no, you just speak in your name.

but maybe we could have a "bonus antag" when we succeed missions against them.

but you know, you really should play farmtown if challenge scares you so much.
assured income, no antag, easy coop, everything in the game obeys your command and if you're bored, you can quit or suicide without disturbing anyone.
really, try it.
otherwise there is tons of iddle game you'll love too.

lol you can easily tell when someone has lost an argument in gaming, when they suggest you leave the game.

Quote from: Tekato on July 26, 2019, 07:18:44 PM

Antags just need to fuck off right out of all my matches.

Agreed

Quote from: sonofoz on July 26, 2019, 08:44:42 PM

yes MSE please, listen to your gamers.
we are playing this game because it's an asymtric pvp one.
so please just fix the various bugs and let us continue to measure our skills against antags/raiders.
even if we have to carry pvp whinners who don't know how to play and that we lose.

Looking at reviews and discussions on the game since release, you are very wrong, the percentage of ppl in this game looking for some stupid, unbalanced and forced asymmetric pvp are not the majority, it’s actually a minority of trollers and griefers that ofc found a game that was set up for them, especially since getting kills as antag can be achieved through cheesy builds, stealth and/or while a raider is occupied with another mob or objective, in essence this games pvp is perfect for those that were found inadequate for proper PVP where you have to face your opponent, those that don’t cut it in games with proper and OPTIONAL PVP, so ofc they will love it here, a game that provides them a nice pool of new, low lvl players and PVE players.

The irony in antags telling someone to get good or worst, them thinking that they themselves are good by winning an antag match ahahahaha.

Suggestions / Re: You need to make Antagonist worthwhile to play

on: July 26, 2019, 01:00:23 AM

Quote from: MSE_Ojuel

Quote from: Marcus4471
Ojuel, the majority don't want an antag. You need to give them a choice or people will walk away. Monitor antag and no antag match figures and see what the overall consensus is and work from there (of course if an antag-no antag choice was given).
We are already monitoring all matches and gathering data from both matches with and without Antagonist, so don't worry about it.

I’m guessing Marcus means monitoring AFTER there’s an actual choice, if PVE queues were ever introduced, right now monitoring matches does squat for measuring where the player base leans towards, since there is no choice.

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