[Level9Drow]

Kill Points have become a second tier PvP between Raiders. I find that my own "allies" are now my enemies. Not only do I have to fight the antag I also have to fight with other Raiders, they NO LONGER feel like my allies and I just get angry with them for interfering with my progression (it was bad enough that the antag could hinder progress, but no other raiders?). Kill Points have caused very greedy and toxic behavior at worst and neglectful desperate behavior at worst. KP are TOO valuable as it cost 1000 for a crappy RNG roll or 3200 for a better RNG roll. Unless you are creating farming squads, which is sad that we are forced to, you simply do not get KP in enough quantity to compensate for the RNG.

1. Raiders ignore objective to farm KP, I know I have. The boss gives no KP, filling aleph to generators or extractors give no KP, killing miners give no KP, etc... so there is no incentive to do these objectives. It would be nice if the objectives gave KP. Or just rename the KP to some other form of currency and put AI kills, player kills, objectives and bosses in the same barrel.

2. There needs to be assists with KP. If you helped killing a grunt but did not get the killing blow it should give you 5. And 15 for Elites and 25 for enemy players respectively. This should also count if an antag does damage to a player and a grunt or elite finishes the player. I've seen a lot of Antags get their KP stolen from their "ally" AI. Boss KP should be split up by how much damage Raiders did, perhaps giving the KP in proportion to % of damage or ranking them from 1st to 4th place and giving set amounts for each place or giving the one who did the most a large portion and everyone else a set amount. This includes bosses like Kuzzman, Valeria, Orb Guardians, Kuzzman Crab, Schneider Mech, etc... They should perhaps five a total of 100 split up in the above systems. Big bosses maybe the same. Although the %th Council could be broken up into brains giving KP, who knows.

3. Objectives like injecting aleph into mission objectives (extractor, engines, etc...), and flipping the switches on En Medias Res should give maybe 15 to 30. And objectives like how many computers Schneider hacks and other more vague yet important objectives that everyone contributes to should give everyone aleph.

4. Miners should give 5 KP and their mines perhaps 1 or 2. Otherwise no one kills miners or shoots mines. Same with tentacles, maybe 10 so people actually go after them. Beholders and other mini bosses should give KP. Probably 30 or base it on who did the most damage and have them shared at about 50 to 80 points total.

What I find myself and others doing because KP are tied only to grunts, elites and players and also because there is no assists KP is that people steal kills. Also people let elites kill allies or at least do not help them fight enemies because they will get the kill stolen. I have had so many times where I have sniped with Shae or Javelin only to wound the enemy and one of the competing jerks on my team swoop in and finish them. This means I don't bother killing enemies as a sniper near my allies if I know I can't one shot them. People just let the invincible elite charge and pound their ally just so they can get the KP instead. And this sucks that this is even a thing.

The final thing I'd like to add is that now that KP have been added to the game it has further reduced what weapons are optimal and what characters are any good for KP. If you use a weapon, say Javelin for example, that is good for killing the boss you are gimping your KP DRASTICALLY because there are no assist and there are no KP for bosses. There is no reason to bring weapons or characters that are good in other ways than gaining KP. You simply slow your advanced mod progress to a slow grind or a halt if you use ANY other weapons or characters than the prescribed meta of rapid kill farming. This is BORING to have to use ONLY a few characters and weapons because you will be punished by the system for using anyone else by way of KP. If some of the systems above were implemented like boss damage KP, Miners, and ASSISTS then it wouldn't be an issue. you could also use weapons you think are fun to use, not merely what kills grunts the fastest.

Ok, I am done with the rant. Please consider changing, OR REMOVING, the KP system. It's boring playing a few characters ad a few weapons. I also hate being enemies with my allies.

Thanks!

[Farfadet]

I couldn't agree more with all you've said. I'm also seeing more and more toxic and selfish players that are supposed to be my allies.

Kill points could be renamed "Mission points" or something like that. And helping with objectives should be highly rewarded. It should also contribute toward the mission score. Otherwise it will be more and more competition between raiders and less and less fun.

Some examples from my personnal experience which illustrate the problem :

- I often see raiders sitting on their stack of alpeh during "A weapon from the past", the WHOLE mission, when the only purpose of the mission is to inject aleph into objectives. They are here exclusively to farm KP, and they don't contribute at all in the mission. They don't even protect the sphere. It can obviously happen with all alpeh based objectives (first phase of "A low blow", overloading kuzman's head on terminal during "Upside Down", ...).

- Too much raiders don't even bother to bring a character/weapon that can damage bosses, especially during "Destroyer of Worlds" (have fun with your Sheperd or any low range weapon...).

The worst in this situation is that, most of the time, those are max-level players that have those behaviours. They have all the gold, talent points, xp and weapon parts they need, the only thing they need is KP. They don't even care to win the mission when they end up with low level players. Instead of carrying the team they just farm.

[SegaSlash]

I start seen this behavior more often when I play with randoms especially xbox players they compete a lot for been the feature player and steal your kills and some even still your alephs after you kill the elites or destroy the alephs from far away if they see you are trying to get it.

I think ppl forget this is a team based game and not a solo "i am the best" player, in games like call of duty, halo, smite or fortnite just to mention some exist this kind of behavior of toxicity that should not be in this game. When I see ppl trying to kill the soldiers I let them be and try to kill other enemies, if i see ppl in need i go fast to help them cause we share lives and is crucial for the mission to stay alive and the protocol of helping each other should be fundamental to succeed as a team. Normally I shared alephs with ppl who has 3 or 4 especially if they are slow like kuzzman or konstantin and if I'm using Rak or Ginebra or Hans I can get aleph fast again, no problem so they have 5 alephs to boost thier cards.

The feature player is so stupid for me cause sometimes the best player doesn't appear there, so if you inject alephs for the objectives, you survive orders or the survival of 1 or 2 mins or help grandpa to survive, etc it doesn't count, for the system the one who kill more is the best. it should be at least 2 feature players in that case the most supportive and the one who did the most damage.

I agree there should be Assist Points cause the greediness in some players is disgusting, normally I run with my buddies and we help each other and farm KP when we need it or try to do missions fast like a challenge or things like that but when you play with randoms oh boy everybody is a lone wolf, steal kills, steal alephs, let you die if need assistance or even if you go help them they leave you there alone with whatever situation you were trying to help them in the 1st place.

People really need to relearn how to play this game in a positive way.
If you guys wanna play sometimes with a person that respect your kills, share alephs, give you shield or heals, help you in need, let you get KP or wanna farm an specific map, or have a better rating in a map for the adventure and simply have fun in general, let me know.